With XM now in the good graces with the FCC over their radio FM transmittion capabilities, many have been wondering about how this affects the Pioneer Inno and Samsung Helix. What is going to happen to the FM transmitter on thse units?
As some are aware (and if not, you are now), the Inno's firmware was updated recently to disable the FM Modulator while you have the Inno in handheld mode or on the Home Dock. This new firmware was also included in all the latest Inno units being shipped out this month. Previously, you were able to plug in the headphones, or dock it in the Home Dock, and instantly you were a walking radio station.
As a refresher, the modifications that XM did to reduce FM transmission was the simply the addition of a ferrite bead. This lowers the FM transmissions just enough to pass the FCC's testing. Great, add a 25-cent part, and everyone's happy.
Now, here's the kicker. Keep in mind that the vehicle itself will actually lower the emissions levels of the FM modulator. But in handheld mode, you don't have the vehicle's insulating effects. So in order to get the emissions low enough to pass in handheld mode, it would compromise the reception you would have in the car. In other words, lowering the FM transmitter in the firmware would make vehicle levels useless.
And that's why it's only available while on the car dock. XM wanted it to work best where it was most needed by the average customer.
I hate to admit it, but that actually makes a great deal of sense. I do agree that MOST requiring the FM mod are those who use it in the car but lack either the cassette player or the funds necessary to get a professional install.
Great. So this means it's never coming back in the firmware?
I'm glad i got one before the update.
Or anyway to go back to the original firmware that allows FM mod while walking around?
XM should really consider allowing the FM mods in home cradels also. I mean "the house itself will actually lower the emissions levels of the FM modulator". Not having it in handheld mode I understand. But not having the ability to use it with a radio w/o audio connectors in-home stinks!
Does anyone have any idea when the new firmware is available for download by current owners who are running 1.05? I'm hoping for bug fixes. :)
I need the FM transmitter to work in handheld mode. You me to tell me that they disabled a feature that I counted on being there when I bought this very expensive, and now partially worthless personal radio. What's with that?
I have not upgraded my firmware. I need the FM modulator to work in handheld mode. When I connect to XM + Napster, I am prompted to upgrade, but I ignore it. So long as I am not forced to upgrade my firmware before I can transfer files between my computer and my Inno, I am safe. I hope that I am not forced to make the upgrade.
Is there any benefit to the firmware upgrade? So far I don't know of any.
Wouldn't it be best just to include the car dock with all inno purchases? That way it would work in the house as well as in the car? Or is it partly because xm wants to sell car kits?
On our last XM radio we used the FM mod both in the car and in the house. In the house it was great to be able to tune a portable radio in another room and listen to XM. That radio broke and we replaced it with the Inno. Now I find that this important feature no longer works. The FM mod should work on the home cradle too!
can't they adjust modulator output levels via firmware?
couldn't they release a firmware version that outputs full power when in the car dock, and reduced power when in portable or home dock mode??
this would be the most logical compromise between usability and FCC regulations.
I think that have the ability to do it, but they won't because they want you to buy the ridiculously overpriced car dock which costs about $70 (for $5 worth of cheap plastic parts)
Is there any way to downgrade back? I was a victim of this malicious act called upgrading, before I was aware of the outcome. I purchased my inno to take the place of my sirius radio and my Ipod, I car pool and we depended on my Ipod for listening pleasure, now I have nothing to offer because of this horrible upgrade. Also, with my Ipod I could have friends over and enjoy playing my Ipod music through my home system with the fm transmitter on it. When will they take Ipod's portability away? I feel like I've downgraded for a huge price!!!!!
I count on using the FM modulator in the home dock. I went out a bought external speakers at Radio Shack that are supposed to plug in to a headphones jack, but they don't work worth a damn.
Fuck the FCC!
Does anyone know if it is possible to hack the firmware, disabling this part of the "upgrade"? Does the tool that downloads the firmware upgrade store it as a file on your hard drive before transfer to the unit? Can it be made to accept a file from the hard drive instead of from the web? What format is it? What is the processor on the Inno? StrongARM?
I fell in love with my Inno, now it is turning into a nightmare.
Has anyone figured out a hack to get the FM modulator to work in handheld mode fo0r the Pioneer Inno? What about just reinstalling the old software, but don't know where to get it. Need real help on this one. bsbbunt@sbcglobal.net
So, can the car cradle be used out side of a vehicle? How does the updated software and Helix/Inno know the difference between a car cradle and a home cradle? This sounds like a fairly easy hack....
It seems that a car cradle would work in the home.. although awkwardly. (Keeping in mind a power converter - DC to AC etc. might be necessary....)
I just got my inno tonight and while I did get a free car kit w/ it, I wanted the fm trans for work, home, and the car. Now I need to buy a 2nd kit to use it in the car and home cuz of this! man screw the FCC. And no, the FM trans does not work in the home cradle, I've tried. You can use the car cradle w/ the home antenna and ac adaptor, but this basically makes the home cradle useless and forces you to buy a 2nd car kit just for the damn cradle. I'd be happy if they would just sell the car cradle by itself for a reduced price over the ridiculus $70.
the car cradle will work in house. i used the home cradle in the car so it would stay upright, but now i must use car cradle for fm. i just hate that now if it is now plugged in it wont run on the battery. so if the power comes unplugged it cuts off. kinda annoying on a bumpy road!
I just got an Inno as a replacement to my Myfi. Had a problem with my myfi, so i took it in to have it fixed/replaced. They dont sell them anymore at Best Buy so i got an Inno as a replacement But now i have no inno for the car. IT does kinda Suck. Anyways..
Myradiostore.com sells XM kits components and everything else XM, i dont have anything to do with the site other than having purchased items for my Myfi when i had that. I think if i remember from looking on there the other day, they do in fact sell the CAR CRADLE only. So for People like myself who already have the Antennas and the Chargers etc, i just need the cradle. I think it was something like 25 bucks.
Something to consider VS buying a complete kit if you already have all the other components. (the Myfi and the inno use all the same chargers/antennas etc)
I do not really see any reason why the FCC has gone out and made them change the firmware to meet FM Mod ratings etc. The MYFI never had any firmware, and as soon as you unplugged the headphones, it would modulate the signal regardless of where it was.
Just got my unit Jan 12th.
Reception is much better than the Piece of Junk MyFi...
I bought the cumbersome Belkin Antenna/Phones and don't really see any improvement over the stock earbuds which I read somewhere have antenna capability themselves.
Bummer about the Modulator but I only used the skyfi modulator function in the car anyways. Most modern devices have line level input capability so you just need a short 3.5 stereo (m) to 3.5 stereo (m) adapter to make it happen with other devices. The audio fidelity is always better direct connected anyways than the modulated broadcast mode.
Did a full charge Friday night then recorded (2) 6 hour sessions of Hair Band channel XM41 (lol) saturday evening and then Cinemagic channel XM27 early Sunday morning.
It has been playing continuously from Sattellite and/or recorded material for at least 7.5 hours now and I plan to let it go until the battery is exhausted to calibrate the battery level meter. Right now at 7+ hours there appears to be about 75% battery left. Does that mean total 28 hrs total? Probably not, the battery meter is being calibrated now, but even so it is pretty descent so far. Especially compared to the "piece of junk MyFi" ---and I am being kind here with choice of words---. I will post back with total run time.
I would like to get just the INNO home cradle accessory so I can reuse the antenna and power from the MyFi as someone had mentioned above. Then I could have the setup downstairs for the Home Theater system amp and speakers, and a rig upstairs to use my PC speakers when I am not using the computer.
Any ideas on if the INNO home cradle is available by itself?
Thanks All
Just got my unit Jan 12th.
Reception is much better than the Piece of Junk MyFi I have had for 2 years...
I bought the cumbersome Belkin Antenna/Phones and don't really see any improvement over the stock earbuds, when using as earphones. I read somewhere that the stock earbuds have antenna capability themselves.
The Belkin unit does seem to help do seem to help when I am using the INNO upstairs to feed the earphone out signal to my computer speaker input which sounds great.
(As long as it is right up against the window...) The insertion of a 3.5 mm into the INNO ear phone output does shut off audio output (line out I assume) to the Belkin earphone speakers.
In this way it is working just as an ugly, poorly fitting uncomfortable to wear, window mounted antenna.
The improvement to the satellite signal is dramatic, from almost nothing to full strength. (with the slider window open) closing the window reduces this quite a bit, but with a partial terrestial and partial satellite signal it seems stable enough for good reception.
Bummer about the xmodulator, that's kind of lame on Pioneer's part. Personally I only used the MyFi modulator function in the car anyways. Most modern devices have speaker/line level input capability so you just need a short 3.5 stereo (m) to 3.5 stereo (m) adapter to make it happen with other devices. The audio fidelity is always better direct connected anyways than with the moduted broadcast mode.
Did a full charge Friday night then recorded (2) 6 hour sessions of "Hair Band" channel XM41 (lol) saturday evening and then Cinemagic channel XM27 early Sunday morning.
It has been playing continuously from satellite and/or recorded material for at least 9.5 hours now and I plan to let it go until the battery is exhausted to calibrate the battery level meter. Right now at 9.5+ hours there appears to be about 33% battery left. Does that mean total @14 hrs total? Probably not, the battery meter is being calibrated now, but even then it is pretty descent so far. Especially compared to the "piece of junk MyFi made by Delphi Electronics" ---and I am being kind here with choice of words---. I will post back with total run time.
I would like to get just the INNO home cradle accessory so I can reuse the antenna and power from the MyFi as someone had mentioned above. Then I could have the setup downstairs for the Home Theater system amp and speakers, and a rig upstairs to use my PC speakers when I am not using the computer. Then I could return the ugly Belkin "antenna phones".
Any ideas on if the INNO home cradle is available by itself?
Thanks All
Battery Update, It just cut out at about 10.5 hours.
Reasonable battery life I guess considering the small battery size and the satellite transceiver this thing has in it.
Has anyone tried powering up the unit with the travel adaptor and a car power adaptor to see if the FM transmitter works in that case?
Has anyone cracked open a home dock to see what differentiates it from a car dock? It may be a simple resistor fix.....
Yes that is a good point about the docking and modulator enable/disable. I'm an Electrical Engineer. Will try to check it out this weekend and see if there is a suitable hack.
BTW the modulator sucks in the Car. Very under powered. My radio is struggling to stay locked in.
I removed the old MyFi Antenna and did a much cleaner routing job with the new antenna which is now positioned much closer to the car antenna than the previous MyFi Antenna. The signal is much worse than the MyFi's modulator. Very hissy and poor quality.
I may try the old car antenna which doesn't have the ferrite installed, and see if it improves...
If this doesn't improve, I may take it back and try the Samsung or something else. I like everything else on the unit way better than the MyFi but I mainly use it for the car, and it is pretty much worthless there...
Home Dock Modulator Enable
I have found a way to enable the modulator in the home dock.
This mod is not possible with the small auxillary power connector.
I would like to know how many may be interested in this modification. You will have a switch on the housing to enable/disable modulation to be able to "Test" the modulator function of your unit while in the home dock. The cost would be $25 and you pay shipping pre-paid. If interested, send an e-mail to above address.
I have a myfi which was replaced by the inno. The interface on the myfi dock looks similar to the inno, but reversed - has anyon tried a mod to the myfi dock to get it to work w/ an inno?
i also was depending on the fm mod, i recently replaced my delphi xm2go and now im suck with a newer radio that doesn't do what i need it to do. so it really limits the use im getting from it which for me limits it portable use. I hope they reconsider putting the fm mod back in use !!
I have a samsung helix and need another car kit but they no longer seem to make them. Does anyone know if the Inno car kit is interchangeable.
YES - the Inno car kit works with the Helix with the exception of the remote. I don't know if it can be programmed to work somehow with the Helix (does anyone?).
I learned a lot from reading this thread, still hoping there's a fix out somehow to bring back fm mod to the home docker or Helix unit itself
I just got the Helix along with the Inno (GEN2) car kit. What I learned was that I would rather use the car kit in the house and the home kit in the car. I use the
cassette tape for live XM listening and prefer to use the FM mod at home.
But, the base of the home kit makes for a clunky fit in the car, and there's no way for the car kit to sit nicely in my home.
So, here's what you can do if you find yourself in the same situation. It does work, I did it just last night:
- Remove the base from the home kit. You technically need a small torx screwdriver, but a small flat screwdriver from a micro screwdriver set (available at most dollar-type stores) works fine.
- Remove both backs from both kits.
- Put the car kit backing on the home kit.
- Put the home kit backing on the car kit.
- Put the home kit base back on the bottom of the car kit.
Walla! now the home kit is the car kit and the car kit is the home kit!
One thing I have found, and I'm not sure if this is the way it is OR I have a defective (original) car kit, but the Helix only charges in the (original) home kit. Since I swapped backs on both, this means I can now charge ONLY in my car. My workaround for this if I need to charge at home is to use the travel adaptor.
Hope someone finds this helpful!
I use my Inno mostly in my work truck, and like to schedule programs for recording during the night or early morning, before I'm in the truck. However, using the car dock disables the "schedule Recording" feature that is only enabled while in the Home Dock. Also, I would really like to be able to schedule recordings when in the handheld mode. I would be interested in the FM enable mod for $25, but would REALLY like to be able to schedule automatic recordings without the unit being in the home dock.
I use my Inno mostly in my work truck, and like to schedule programs for recording during the night or early morning, before I'm in the truck. However, using the car dock disables the "schedule Recording" feature that is only enabled while in the Home Dock. Also, I would really like to be able to schedule recordings when in the handheld mode. I would be interested in the FM enable mod for $25, but would REALLY like to be able to schedule automatic recordings without the unit being in the home dock.
I think we are in for a substantial refund on these crippled tuners. Having to spend 50 - 80 dollars more to make it work is fraud in advertising.
Does anyone know how to enable the FM modulator in home dock?
Yes, after some analysis of circuitry compared to a Pioneer Car Kit2, I modified my home dock for my Samsung Helix to enable the FM modulator to work at home. This Samsung Helix that I have transmits a strong enough signal that I can receive it throughout my house. My outdoor roof antenna even picks up the signal and it is 2 stories up on the roof!
RIAA,FCC,&XM - screw-em - here's how to mod ur INNO homedock to enable the FM modulator. $25 for a .25 cent part - my ass. Find a techy who can solder small stuff without screwin them up. Solder a 3.3Kohm resister between pin 9 and pin 10 of J4, on the "BUNA DOCK RF P5 card (inside the home dock). The card that the antenna plugs into. Send an email to inno@badasshacker.com if ur the type who has to see a pic. This mod is so easy "A Cave Man could doit". XM has the firmware checking the headphone jack, so don't plug one in. U can use the USB cable for a transmitting antenna. Happy modding! :-)
RIAA,FCC,&XM - screw-em - here's how to mod ur INNO homedock to enable the FM modulator. $25 for a .25 cent part - my ass. Find a techy who can solder small stuff without screwin them up. Solder a 3.3Kohm resister between pin 9 and pin 10 of J4, on the "BUNA DOCK RF P5 card (inside the home dock). The card that the antenna plugs into. Send an email to inno@badasshacker.com if ur the type who has to see a pic. This mod is so easy "A Cave Man could doit". XM has the firmware checking the headphone jack, so don't plug one in. U can use the USB cable for a transmitting antenna. Happy modding! :-)
I am super pissed about the FM modulator. I didn't know what I was doing when I updated my inno the other day. BUT I am still listening to live XM in my home dock by using the xm tape cassette from my car. I'll be damned if Pioneer gets another penny from me since they took away something I already paid for in the first place. Screw the FCC!
Help!
Love the *concept* of the INNO I bought a few years back @ $350. BUT, the XM reception has never been good. It's choppy. Verrrrrry annoying.
I live where no building is over about 4 stories tall. I knew it was bad when I went to the beach and had the exact sad problem: 3 seconds of good XM, 1.5 of air..
Pioneer HIGHLY, and rudely encouraged me to upgrade to the 2.1 firmware.
a) I cannot find this link anywhere online ;
b) every post seems to blast the firmware upgrade,
I trust YOU folks, the actual users. I love XM, and want to walk my 4 miles a day, isten to XM, downloadable music and FM.
Isn't that what INNO was supposed to be?
I care nothing about the at-home thing, just the outdoors.
H-E-L-P !!!!!!!
Here's my e-mail if anyone can help. I am Disabled, and I saved up for 6 months to buy this darn INNO to do my Rehab walking.
scarlettbama@charter.net
Thnaks, and have a blessed day!
Sally in Alabama
scarlettbama@charter.net
Is the Canadian firmware the same as the US version. Looks like their channel lineup is the same as far as programing goes. The US firmware is controlled by the FCC, however the FCC has no authority in Canada so is it possible that thier FM transmitter might still work undocked? www.xmradio.ca
I would guess the canadian and US units are the same. I can see a japanese version being different. I will check it out, as I live in Canada and would love to have this feature, and would sell my inno1.
I've experienced the same frustration with the poor quality FM modulator. I recently bought a "Monster" brand FM Modulator for my Sony Walkman/MP3 player. It cost $25 at Sears. I tried plugging in the Monster FM modulator into the headphone jack on the Inno and it works great. You might consider giving this a try. I own a XM Roady Two that is about 5 years old. The FM Modulator it it works so good that I can have it on in my car (in the garage) and can tune in the signal in my living room in the house.
I purchased the Inno radio to listen to the Ophra show in the house. It would only work if I put it in my dining room window and who wants to sit in the dining room to listen to the radio. So, I spent over 2 hours on the phone trying to get XM to fix it but they said it needed an antenna on the roof. So, I tried to get a refund and cancel the service. They refused to refund the money but did cancel the service but charged me $100. I was transfered to many departments and cut off 5 times. It is my opinion they have terrible customer service and most of the time I was talking to someone in Panama or India. And you know how much fun that was.
I purchased the Inno radio to listen to the Ophra show in the house. It would only work if I put it in my dining room window and who wants to sit in the dining room to listen to the radio. So, I spent over 2 hours on the phone trying to get XM to fix it but they said it needed an antenna on the roof. So, I tried to get a refund and cancel the service. They refused to refund the money but did cancel the service but charged me $100. I was transfered to many departments and cut off 5 times. It is my opinion they have terrible customer service and most of the time I was talking to someone in Panama or India. And you know how much fun that was.
I purchased the Inno radio to listen to the Ophra show in the house. It would only work if I put it in my dining room window and who wants to sit in the dining room to listen to the radio. So, I spent over 2 hours on the phone trying to get XM to fix it but they said it needed an antenna on the roof. So, I tried to get a refund and cancel the service. They refused to refund the money but did cancel the service but charged me $100. I was transfered to many departments and cut off 5 times. It is my opinion they have terrible customer service and most of the time I was talking to someone in Panama or India. And you know how much fun that was.
I purchased the Inno radio to listen to the Ophra show in the house. It would only work if I put it in my dining room window and who wants to sit in the dining room to listen to the radio. So, I spent over 2 hours on the phone trying to get XM to fix it but they said it needed an antenna on the roof. So, I tried to get a refund and cancel the service. They refused to refund the money but did cancel the service but charged me $100. I was transfered to many departments and cut off 5 times. It is my opinion they have terrible customer service and most of the time I was talking to someone in Panama or India. And you know how much fun that was.